Staphylococcus aureus enterotoxins (intestinal toxins) have been demonstrated to affect airway disease including Asthma in early life according to multiple studies. The study of Asthma and Bacteria in early life is very interesting.
To further the WAF misson to improve our understanding of what drives Severe Asthma, the World Asthma Foundation reached out to Rodney Dietert, PhD, for his thoughts on the topic of Asthma and Staphylococcus aureus.
Rodney Dietert, PhD is a Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life.
Asthma and Bacteria in Early Life: Staphylococcus Aureus
This is the second interview of three on the topic of Asthma and Staphylococcus aureus with Rodney Dietert, PhD. Today we learn about:
Relationship between Asthma and Staphylococcus aureus
Multinational studies on the topic of Asthma and Staphylococcus aureus
Importance of diet
Asthma and Bacteria in Early Life: Staphylococcus Aureus
World Asthma Foundation: Can you talk about the relationship between Staph A and Asthma as a biomarker in early life?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: Yes. There’s a multi-nation study that was done to look at the nasal microbiome in early life. They were measuring that two, four, six, nine months up through to two years and then looked, among their cohorts, at asthma between ages 6 and 18.
Nasal Microbiota Findings
What they found was really striking. They found four major categories of progression of the nasal microbiota as the infant aged. There was one of those groups where Staph A was the most prevalent bacterium or Staphylococcus, and particularly Staph A, that was present. The two-month major (bacterium). It was the main bacterium.
That group that started that way, at two months, had, I think it ranged from age 6 to 18, they were measuring asthma and that microbiome beginning (2 months). That contributed to 45 to 60% of the asthma among all of those children they were evaluating. Just from that one (microbiota) type. That was really an impressive predictor of asthma in later childhood. That suggests you don’t want to see Staph A like that, in a two-month-year-old baby. If you do, you better do something about it.
Staph A
Now, again, that is still an association but we understand what Staph A does to the immune system, because of what it does in terms of producing toxins that actually are allergens or can be allergens, what it does to IgE production. You know if that is really the prevalent nasal bacteria at that age and that is not what you usually see, that’s a problem. Right there, there is a biomarker in my opinion that should be a red flag. We should be looking to do something about that.
Sweet Consumption
There are also studies in early life that show consumption of sweets is a contributing factor to the risk when you’ve got Staph A in there. Some of the children actually seem to have a receptor detection of sweet issue. There’s a cohort that actually can’t tell that they’ve really had what would be considered an overabundance of sweets. They’re a little resistant to detecting it, so they eat more and that actually will propel them to severe asthma later on. That combination of Staph A, and diet even, is very important.
Asthma and Bacteria in Early Life: Staph A, Rodney Dietert PhD
For additional information on Asthma and Staphylococcus aureus and the WAF defeating Asthma Project, visit:
To further the WAF mission to improve our understanding of what drives Severe Asthma, the World Asthma Foundation reached out to Rodney Dietert, PhD for his thoughts on the topic of Asthma and the bacteria Staphylococcus aureus.
Staphylococcus aureus (S. aureus) is a Gram positive (thick wall) bacterium that is believed to be carried by about one third of the general population and is responsible for common and serious diseases. A growing amount of medical literature suggest that Staphylococcus aureus enterotoxins (intestinal toxins)could affect airway disease including Asthma.
Rodney Dietert, PhD is a Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life
This is the first interview of three on the topic of Staphylococcus aureus with Rodney Dietert, Phd. We learn about:
* Connection between Asthma and bacteria Staph A * Skin, nose and gut Microbiome * Asthma and the immune system
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Dietert, can you connect Staphylococcus Aureus or Staph A and Chronic Disease including Asthma for us?
Connection between Asthma and Bacteria Staph A: Video
Rodney Dietert PhD. connects Staph A and Asthma (and other chronic diseases)
Rodney Dietert, PhD: Yes, well, it’s very interesting because there’s a lot of research starting to come out on infectious agents and chronic diseases. We used to think that never the two shall meet but in fact, they do in many cases, either by inducing chronic diseases or by exacerbating those conditions.
Staph A, that is gram-positive bacterium, it is serious in terms of potential infections. We have it most often on the skin and in the nose. It can be either carried there or it can be a transient exposure. It also contributes to food poisoning. It’s one of the agents that, if contaminated, food can produce serious GI problems. It has a number of products that it makes including what are called enterotoxins or exotoxins. These can punch holes in cells. They can damage epithelial layers in the gut or in the airways.
They also are very interesting, in the case of Staph A or Staphylococcus aureus because some of these toxins can serve as allergens. They are actually sensitizing agents and that is the unknown, until recently, discovery, that when you’re looking for allergens that may contribute to asthma, you’d better include integral elements of that particular bacterium because that may be your allergen, that you may or may not have tested for.
World Asthma Foundation:Can you explain the interaction between the Microbiome, Staph A and Asthma?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: Well, as with any potential opportunistic pathogen, the status of our microbiome in the body sites that carry it, and that would be where we’re exposed to the environment, so the airways, respiratory system, the skin, the gut, the urogenital tract, the status of that microbiome is incredibly important in terms of whether those pathogens can gain a foothold and then produce an infection. That is absolutely the case with Staph A.
Breaking the skin may give it (an opportunity to infect) , or surgery (as well). You have Staph A, and particularly drug-resistant Staph A, (as) a potential risk with surgeries but, (also) I mentioned food poisoning, breaking the skin. Also, dysbiosis, we call it, or a problem with the microbiome in the nose really can result in (Staph A problems), not just chronic sinusitis or reoccurring infections, but asthma. (The bacterium) can be inducing the condition, (and/or) it can be exacerbating already existing asthma.
Rodney Dietert, PhD: (Staph A) has been identified as one of the major culprits that is in the nose and where it can gain a foothold, (it) can produce some real problems.
World Asthma Foundation:What’s the distinction between infection and colonization in the context of Staph A and Asthma?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: Well, colonization is really where it’s able to attach to the proximity of the epithelium, or maybe directly to the surface. It can then produce its toxins and damage the epithelium and also have a nutrient source and spread. The thing to keep in mind is your friendly bacteria, your microbiota, that are mutualistic bacteria, or commensals they’re also called, the ones that we take as probiotics. Those actually have something like double-digit processes they can use to block pathogens like Staph A. Their being in place and metabolizing, in this case in the nose, is really important.
There is a recent really beautiful study that was published looking at early life and looking at colonization by bacteria in the nose and the prognosis for those children to develop asthma or not and some of the parameters related to that. That is where you can really see that starting to think about Staph A and asthma is critical immediately at birth and in the early few months. That’s where some of these distinctions are made and where, unfortunately, you can set up the immune system for inflammation in the lung.
World Asthma Foundation: You have a background in Immmunotoxicology. Can you define this role?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: Immunotoxicity is basically any environmental or external directed alteration to the immune system, in a negative way, damage to the immune system. That damage can take all kinds of different forms. Now, I have to say in my earlier years as a professor in the era of AIDS, HIV and AIDS, everybody thought, well, it’s all immunosuppression. My mantra has been, I contend that there are very few things that produce (only) pure immunosuppression. Something goes down and usually something else goes up (within the immune system) quite frankly. That part of what goes up is (often) allergy, autoimmunity, and inflammatory disease.
We used to measure, in the earlier days of immunology, we’ll measure things and say, “Wow, the antibody levels are reduced,” or something like that. We weren’t measuring more complex indicators for auto-immunity allergic diseases like asthma and psoriasis, inflammatory conditions. Had we been doing that (measuring the more complex indicators of immune-inflicted chronic diseases), we would see that some things we thought that were either immunosuppressive or not (and deemed safe), were not actually where the excitement (most significant risk) was for damage to the immune system.
The damage (connected to improper immune enhancement/balance) can (lead to) self-inflicted disease produced largely by immune cells (that are) out of control and misregulated. When you’re talking about asthma, that’s where you are. (It) is (that) you have cells and mediators in the lung doing things out of balance that they shouldn’t be doing.
World Asthma Foundation: You advocate and have written extensively about Sustainable Healthcare. In fact, you write about the cost of chronic disease. Can you summarize the findings of the World Economics Council and Harvard study predicting that Chronic Disease will consume 48% of Global GDP by 2030?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: That’s worldwide net worth, and we can’t afford it. If you’re thinking about healthcare being sustainable and being available for people in the future, for our children, for our grandchildren, then we’ve got to do things differently. We should do a better job of preventing chronic diseases like asthma and we certainly should do a better job of managing these (chronic diseases) with the life course in mind.
When a child presents with asthma, the pediatrician quite frankly, in my opinion, should be asking, “What can I do for that child today? What can I do to prevent comorbid diseases 10, 20, 30, 40 years from now?” I think the second part of that we have not yet fully embraced and dealt with.
World Asthma Foundation:What would you like researchers to know about the relationship between Staph A and chronic disease?
Rodney Dietert, PhD: I think they need to realize again that the starting point, birth and the first few months, is the time to do something. (In early life) it is easier (to make the most significant changes) and (those actions taken during early development are) likely to be more permanent (as the infant ages). (Also, there is an opportunity to insulate that child from even some problems, maybe diet or otherwise, later in life that (otherwise) could be a risk factor.
That’s the time to do something. Where you get bigger bang for the buck, is early (in life). Researchers simply need to know to look for infectious agents that are involved with conditions like asthma and to start to realize that their management needs to start and stop with the microbes that are protecting the individual, the friendly microbes or microbiota, and to ensure that that is in balance.
If you’re hoping to nudge the immune system in a more useful way, you’re hoping to control inflammation, it’s my contention that if you don’t correct the microbiome, you’re going to be back in the same boat, on the leakyboat, (the) sinking boat, shortly, with your treatments.
There’s sort of a fingerprint of (the) respiratory microbiome, and particularly in the nose, that reflects asthma existing. There’s the chicken or egg question, which comes first, and what’s a result of (what)? Nevertheless, if you don’t actually address that (the respiratory microbiome which affects both risk of Staph A infection and lung immune status) in any meaningful way, then you’ve got to know that the tendency is there that (it is) going to snap back at some point. It’s going to bite you (with an elevated risk of and/or exacerbation of asthma).
WAF will continue to investigate the link between asthma and bacteria.
World Asthma Foundation” Defeating Asthma Series Uncovers New Hope for Asthma Management
Asthmatics: Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma. Looking at Asthma and Sustainable Healthcare, keeping costs under control while delivering high quality healthcare.
In this interview with Rodney Dietert, PhD Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life we learn about the benefits of Sustainable Healthcare and what we should be thinking about to get there.
Interview on Asthma and Sustainable Healthcare
World Asthma Foundation: You write about the microbiome and sustainable health care. Can you explain why this matters?
Dr. Dietert: I think that recent estimates from CDC and WHO, that global death by these non-communicable diseases like asthma, inflammatory bowel, and the like, it’s not just developed countries but developing countries as well. Is 70-75% of all deaths are from these conditions.
You might note that people live sometimes many decades with these conditions with polypharmacy. Furthermore, if you have one of those, you have a really good chance as you age of having more. That requires additional medications, each one with different side effects, and potential drug interactions can occur.
We think we’re very healthy because of longevity. But we lead a lot of our life in illness and sometimes stressing our caregivers’ system because some of these (conditions) require caregivers as well. There’s a different path. That (the present path) is not, in my mind, a sustainable path.
Testing Sustainable Healthcare
My family are well represented in some of these diseases. We know the trajectory, we’ve lived the trajectory and there’s a different way to go. Once you recognize that it starts with our interaction with the external world, and the microbiome is the interface. It’s what they see: the chemicals, drugs, food first. And what we get is what they’ve dealt with and left behind or metabolized and reacted to.
Control What Can Be Controlled
We can and should control that and it should be integrated so we’re dealing with it like the regenerative agriculture people. Dealing with the soil, the air, the water, the plants, the animals, and us as a continuum of microbial interactions, where we can really have everything be healthy and sustainable.
Reduce Disease Prevalence
If we do that, we’re going to reduce the prevalence of these diseases. The drug companies will find other ways to continue to be profitable in a sustainable way, but we don’t need to be chasing symptoms of some of these diseases but instead cure the disease.
Treating Symptoms Not Causes
Quite frankly, I think I’ve discussed in the book, we’ve cured very few of these diseases. We treat symptoms. In fact, we only treat presenting symptoms. I’ve shown how these diseases are all very much connected as co-morbid factors of each other. A child diagnosed with asthma, we know what kind of diseases are likely to show up in those groups of children with asthma as they age.
In my mind, physicians have yet to deal with that. They actually don’t do things that stop that from happening in a 30, 40, 50-year old when they see a child with asthma. They treat the symptom of the day. That’s a change and a change that would allow us to be much more sustainable in our health and in our medicine that we practice.
Asthma and Sustainable Healthcare, Rodney Dietert PdD
World Asthma Foundation “Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Managementant
Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma.
In this interview with Marie-Claire Arrieta Ph.D, Assistant Professor Depts. of Physiology and Pharmacology & Pediatrics Cumming School of Medicine University of Calgary Health Research Innovation Centre, Calgary, Alberta, Canada we learn that:
A significant proportion of asthmatics have severe asthma that also cannot be controlled easily with the current treatments
The microbiome is not only bacteria just like other ecosystems. Not only bacteria but they’re mix including environmental fungi
The microbiome is full of viruses as well
Interview
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Arrieta, what prompted your research in this area?
Dr. Arrieta: As you know, asthma has no known cures. A significant proportion of asthmatics have severe asthma that also cannot be controlled easily with the current treatments, so we’re trying to figure out ways of improving both the prevention and the potential therapies for asthma. We also know that asthma has become an epidemic disease in Canada. At least it’s quadrupled in incidence over only 30 years, and we know that it’s mainly environmental factors that are explaining or possibly explaining this really great increase in incidence for asthma.
We’ve come to learn in the past 10 years that the microbiome is implicated. The gut microbiome is this very large community of microbes that we all harbor in our inner guts. However, The vast majority of these studies of the microbiome and asthma have only included bacteria, including studies that I have participated in before. This only provides a part of the view of this vast variety of microbes that we know inhabit this microbial ecosystem.
The microbiome is not only bacteria just like other ecosystems. Not only bacteria but they’re mixed, and they definitely include fungi. We thought that studying the role of fungi would be important because molds and environmental fungi are quite common triggers of asthma attacks in asthmatics, also for people with allergies. This, we thought, may suggest that the fungi in the microbiome, that no one has been studying much before, may be involved in some of the immune education that happens early in life that may later in childhood lead to this uncontrolled inflammation in the airways towards environmental fungi, along with other environmental triggers of asthma. That’s why we wanted to look at fungi.
World Asthma Foundation: Excellent. Great study. I’m most impressed. What are some of the key findings?
Dr. Arrieta: We found by giving specific species or types of fungi and/or bacteria to mice, and we used a specific type of mouse known as the germ-free mouse. These are mice that are kept completely devoid of microbes, so they’re like a blank state that you can associate with microbes in a way that would allow you to then make good conclusions from the experiment.
We found that fungi have a very important role in the way the microbiome establishes early in life. When I say microbiome, now I mean a combination of both bacteria and fungi. We also found that fungi are sensed by the immune system differently than bacteria in a way that they seem to amplify the immune response. For example, we found that mice that were colonized only with fungi were more susceptible to asthma.
World Asthma Foundation: Interesting. Along with that, what were some of the other key findings?
Dr. Arrieta: The story’s definitely developing. This study was certainly a proof of concept, but based on this work as well as others that are starting to look at fungi too, we think that when fungi in the intestine of babies bloom, for example, during an antibiotic treatment, this may change the way the immune system responds to this microbiome that is now higher in proportion with certain fungi. This may also increase the susceptibility to those immune alterations that can later lead to asthma in certain people.
World Asthma Foundation: Interesting. I noticed that you mentioned several references to Candida albicans. How does that fit into the mix?
Dr. Arrieta: We don’t know yet. We chose Candida because it’s a very common yeast in our guts. Virtually everyone would have some candida in their bodies, not just in their guts, but it’s a very common inhabitant. Because of that, we wanted to use a species that was common. We found that Candida certainly can outgrow during antibiotic treatments. It may be one of the species implicated, but we’re not there yet. We’re now trying more species of fungi. In fact, we started a new set of experiments based on an infant clinical study that we just completed that showed us exactly which are the yeast and fungal species that bloom when babies are given antibiotics.
This was an interesting clinical study. We ran it at the emergency department of one of our children’s hospitals where we enrolled babies under six months of age, that for one reason or another had to take an antibiotic. This is a very common occurrence for infants. Then what we did was that we followed the microbiome during this antibiotic treatment, and we were able to identify the most common yeasts that seem to outgrow during the antibiotic treatment. We’re focusing on those, and surprisingly, Candida is not one of those all the time. It seems that, of course, Candida is there, but there’s other fungi that are able to outcompete other ones including Candida. Those are the ones that we’re focusing on now.
World Asthma Foundation:Thank you for that. By outcompete, the suggestion or the inference would be that the imbalance of fungi and bacteria are what’s causing the inflammation process?
Dr. Arrieta: That could be that case. That will be the next step, but as I said, the story is very much developing. I think we’re one of the first ones, but we’re not the only ones interested in studying the fungal component of the microbiome and how it relates to allergies and asthma. I think that in the next couple of years we’re going to learn a lot more.
World Asthma Foundation: Fair enough. What implications are there for asthma? Asthma rates are on the rise. What would you like asthmatics to know about your study?
Dr. Arrieta: For now, because the study is developing, I think what we know for sure is that the gut microbiome during early life is extremely important when it comes to, in general, immune development. Because asthma, of course, is an immune disease, these changes in the gut microbiome can certainly determine a baby’s risk to develop this disease, especially as we now understand in families that have a familial history of asthma as well.
What is important to asthmatics to know? There are certain lifestyle, changes, or behaviors that are now being recommended, including natural birth if, of course, is safe and possible, the use of breast milk over formula if it is possible. One of the things that we’re learning more about is that one of the ways to foster a healthy microbiome early in life is when babies start eating solid foods to make the diet as healthy as possible, the way nutritionists have been asking as to do so for decades now because this will foster a varied microbiome.
World Asthma Foundation: Good point. A fair amount of adult asthmatics suffer from fungal issues relative to lung inflammation and infection. Any thoughts on that?
Dr. Arrieta: There’s a couple of clinical studies, and I wish I remember from the top of my head the name of the drug exactly, that is being tested right now. I’m by no means, involved in this. I have just been reading it with great interest because it is an immune modulator. It’s a biological drug that targets some of the immune mechanisms that we now know recognize fungi. It’ll be really interesting to see now from the point of view of these patients, both children, and adults, that have fungal asthma, if this is really going to change their treatment options because as you know, those asthma tend to be more severe and harder to treat as well.
World Asthma Foundation: What would you like the scientific community to know about your research?
Dr. Arrieta: That within this revolution of studying that microbiome, I think we’re missing out by only focusing on bacteria. There’s a great deal that I have learned from my colleagues in microbial ecology. I am not an ecologist, but I started to partner up with them because of the methods and the concepts, and scientific frameworks that they used to study the microbiome. The microbiome is an ecosystem, and we have experts that have been studying ecosystems for decades before biomedical researchers started to study ecosystems. The inclusion of fungi, I think, will get us more answers. Also, the inclusion of other microorganisms that very few people, if any, are considering right now in the context of asthma research, which are viruses, very popular of course now because we’re under a pandemic. The microbiome is full of viruses and children experience many viral infections during the first year of life or the first two years of life. How does the immune system react to that? How does it get educated? I think that using a broader, more ecologically informed approach to study the microbiome is a lesson that I have learned over the years and I hope that others follow suit too.
World Asthma Foundation “Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Managementant
Asthmatics: Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma.
In the sixth in a series of interviews with Rodney Dietert, PhD Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life we learn about:
Existing evidence clearly demonstrates an association between asthma initiation and the microbiome, both respiratory and gastro-intestinal
Regenerative Agriculture is good for the microbiome
A diet that is not diverse results in a depleted microbiome
People or animals with a depleted microbiome are open to getting some microbiome components from others and the environment around them
Interview
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Dietert, Can you talk about a) different types of microbiomes, and b) microbiome sharing?
Video interview: Asthma and Microbiome Sharing – Rodney Dietert, Phd
Dr. Dietert: I’ve had an opportunity to lecture at a couple of different conferences. I’ll mention them if you don’t mind. The Quivira Collection – Regenerative Agriculture Conference in Albuquerque and then the Organic and Natural Health Annual Conference was in Florida. You put those two groups together, again, the regenerative agriculture, farmers, ranchers, and scientists doing things in ways that we never envisioned in terms of integration.
They start with the soil, and they start with animals and insects and how you use them together in an ecosystem to really be productive as a rancher or a farmer but to really support the microbiome of soil, of the plants and the diversity of the plants because those are foodstuffs for their production animals. It turns out the more plants that you may have contributing to the diet, the more robust, in a sense, and diversified the production animal is and the phytonutrients that you will gain through the meat or through the milk or through the eggs from that production animal. It is mind-blowing, it is absolutely mind-blowing.
If you don’t mind just a short story, we have examples of that. You have something like the howler monkey in Vietnam, I believe, eats normally in the wild 57 species of plants. In Vietnamese zoos, they eat maybe 12. I forget the exact number but lower double digits. There are some effects on the microbiome. In the US zoos, they eat one plant species. Guess what’s represented in their microbiome which is a very severely degraded microbiome? Their microbiome becomes humanized with the microbes from the animal handlers.
Actually, the same thing happens in our lab rodents, our lab mice, and our lab rats. They are not like wild mice and rats living out in the wild. They are in a very constrained animal handling setting, and they actually acquire the animal technicians’ microbes to some extent. Investigators working on the immune system, for example, told me, “We were doing these great experiments everything was working and then they didn’t.” Turned out there was a new building built, and they moved their animals over there, or they changed all their staff in the animal facility.
It’s a lesson for us that if you’re in a depleted state, you will pick up microbes from your surroundings. One other point about that that’s interesting is that I talked about non-communicable diseases, NCDs. If I wrote that book now, and I am planning a follow-up book, I wouldn’t use that acronym because a lot of people ask me, they say, “I have asthma or I have Crohn’s. We’re not genetically related but my spouse living in the same household, eating the same food, same air, also developed it later on. Is there any chance these things are actually slightly communicable?” The answer is, more and more, yes, slightly communicable is probably right.
If you get a really depleted microbiome state like you’ve had Lyme disease or something, you have multiple extensive rounds of antibiotics and your household has a microbiome that has — you can argue which came first but — is an asthma microbiome or is a Crohn’s or something, psoriasis, yes, you are open to donation. It could be from your home or hotel room or an airplane but you’re open to something getting in. There are tipping points where there’s some evidence that it’s not like a regular pandemic but to some extent, to say it’s non-communicable is not quite right because we’re sharing microbes all the time.
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Dietert, we certainly thank you for your time, all that you do for the microbiome and the community. Good afternoon, and thanks again.
Dr. Dietert: Well, and thank you for all you do with the World Asthma foundation, Bill. Pleasure.
In this fifth in a series of interviews with Rodney Dietert PhD, he talks about communication between the gut and lung. Dr. Dietert is Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life we learn about:
* The Gut and lung communication and its relationship to Asthma
World Asthma Foundation “Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Managementant
Asthmatics: Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma.
Interview
World Asthma Foundation: Research into the Microbiome and its relationship to health has improved significantly in the last few years. For example, we now know about the relationship between the gut and health. We’ve also learned about communication between the gut and the lung and the impact on Asthma. Dr. Dietert, so there’s some crosstalk, right?
Video interview: Asthma Connection to Gut and Lung Cross Talk – Rodney Dietert, PhD
Dr. Dietert: Tremendous crosstalk, absolutely tremendous. You’re correct that if you’re looking at endpoints, something like risk of asthma or management of asthma, then you really, at a minimum, are going to focus both on the respiratory system microbiome and the gut microbiome. That’s not necessarily the exclusion of others but those two are really important. Just like the gut microbiome can affect the brain, it can affect behavior, mood. You don’t need lots of hardcore meds as an antidepressant when you’ve got the solution sitting right in your gut in terms of the microbiome.
With the respiratory system, you’ve got both the local microbes being extremely important but you have crosstalk, you have chemical interactions that are originating in the gut that are affecting the respiratory system as well.
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Dietert, we certainly thank you for your time, all that you do for the microbiome and the community. Good afternoon, and thanks again.
Dr. Dietert: Well, and thank you for all you do with the World Asthma foundation, Bill. Pleasure.
Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Managementant
In this fourth in a series of interviews with Rodney Dietert, PhD Cornell University Professor Emeritus, Health Scientist Head of Translational Science + Education for SEED and the Author of the Human Super-Organism How the Microbiome is Revolutionizing the Pursuit of a Healthy Life we learn about:
* Replacing replacing missing microbes
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Dietert can we replace missing microbes?
Dr. Dietert: There are products available and we have used a product that is a missing skin microbe. It’s very important in certain metabolic pathways that actually help provide health benefits that are beyond the skin.
Video: Can we replace missing microbes? – Rodney Dietert Ph.D.
That was one that basically was recovered in a very interesting way that involved essentially marriages between some indigenous people and others that were westernized and the microbe being able to not necessarily be removed from a remote location but being able to be a part of what we would call genetically an F1.
There are opportunities to retrieve some missing microbes. I think Dr. Blaser and his wife have done incredible work by the way as well, very much attuned and will have a lot to offer on what’s missing and where is it and can it be retrieved. I think the answer is yes. There are commercial products and we’ve actually used some of them that are the missing microbes.
It’s important to recognize that some of the indigenous peoples that have not had the same environmental experiences that we’ve had, and the same contact with modernization have microbes that are exceptionally important for health are helping prevent obesity and asthma and diabetes in those populations. Those microbes are really the protectors.
Yes, I think that reintroducing those to the extent it is possible is an extremely worthwhile effort.
I would point out that it’s a fragile situation because I think from Dr. Blaser and his wife’s work, you will learn that the indigenous populations in South America if they go into the urban areas, if their children go into the urban areas, start adopting the diet and lifestyle there, it takes no time at all for them to acquire the same set of diseases that we see so prevalent here.
World Asthma Foundation: With that, Dr. Dietert, we certainly thank you for your time, all that you do for the microbiome and the community. Good afternoon, and thanks again.
Dr. Dietert: Well, and thank you for all you do with the World Asthma foundation, Bill. Pleasure.
Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Management
In this interview with Justin L. Sonnenburg PhD, Associate Professor of Microbiology and Immunology at Stanford University, we learn about:
* Testing for Microbes within the Microbiome
* That we’re in the early stages of our understanding of the Microbiome
* Research that still needs to be done
Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma.
“Diseases largely driven by inflammation and an altered immune system. If we start to take our gut microbiota into account, as we live our life, as we make medical decisions, eat different foods and potentially even eventually reintroduce some of these lost microbes, how profound can the impact be on our health?” Justin L. Sonnenburg Ph.D
Interview
World Asthma Foundation: Dr. Sonnenburg, can we test for what’s in the microbiome?
Video Interview Can we test for whats in the Microbiome? – Justin L. Sonnenburg PhD
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: On an individual level, there are companies that offer testing for the different species to give you the composition of what’s in your microbiome. I can’t speak to the validity of any of these companies, but there are commercial entities out there that will provide a profile for individuals.
World Asthma Foundation: Thanks. Do you know if it’s specific? For example, research reflects that Bifidobacterium breve and Lactobacillus specifically have been targeted. I’m not a hundred percent sure if it’s inflammation or infection or both, it seems to be successful. The question is, can we test for those specific bacteria?
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: There are targeted tests out there for specific bacteria that where we think given the species may be of interest. Of course, this is most famous for infectious agents. If you want to go in and see if you have Clostridium difficile or salmonella or something like that, there are specific targeted tests. These are less common for the good guys in our gut. I think part of the reason is we still don’t have a great understanding of what the good guys are.
There are studies out there that indicate certain associated with health States are associated with being able to fight off specific problems.
In general, quite often what’s found for one population when surveyed in an independent population doesn’t necessarily hold up.
There’s just extreme variability in the gut microbiome. I think as much as we know about the field is still how fundamental this community is to our health, we’re still at a really early stage of understanding what is healthy and also coming to grips with the fact that there is no single definition of healthy, that healthy really depends on the individual, the context, and many other factors.
World Asthma Foundation: It’s a complex issue and relatively emerging, right?
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: Exactly. A lot of research still needs to be done.
World Asthma Foundation: Thank you everything that you do on a daily basis for the gut microbiome, certainly for your teachings and your writings and for your time today. Appreciate it.
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: Wonderful being with you. Thanks so much.
Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Management
In this interview with Justin L. Sonnenburg PhD, Associate Professor of Microbiology and Immunology at Stanford University, we learn diseases largely driven by inflammation and an altered immune system may benefit from taking our microbiome into account.
Our understanding of Asthma and the way we treat it may soon be radically different from what currently exists, due to new research on the human microbiome and how the microbiome affects asthma.
“Diseases largely driven by inflammation and an altered immune system. If we start to take our gut microbiota into account, as we live our life, as we make medical decisions, eat different foods and potentially even eventually reintroduce some of these lost microbes, how profound can the impact be on our health?” Justin L. Sonnenburg Ph.D
Interview
World Asthma Foundation: Can you talk about the link between microbes and Western inflammatory diseases? We know there are billions of microbes good and bad in our body and research links some to wellness and some to disease. The big question is can we test for whether we are populated with these microbes or not?
Video: Microbes and Inflammatory Disease Justin L. Sonnenburg PhD
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: On a population level, it’s very clear that some of the microbes that have been associated with humans over the course of our evolution for probably hundreds of thousands of years.
The reason that we know that is if we go to different traditional populations like Hunter-gatherers in different parts of the planet, like Africa, South America, Papua new Guinea all over the place.
We see microbes associated with these populations and many of these populations are completely healthy except for maybe increased incidents of infectious disease. They certainly don’t have many chronic inflammatory diseases.
These microbes are present in all of these populations but missing from industrialized populations were incredibly rare or reduced abundance. At a population level, we can see that for instance, all Americans are missing specific groups of bacteria that we know were- we harbored for hundreds of thousands of years as we migrated around the planets in our past around the planet to different parts of the world.
On an individual level, there still is a lot of variability. The microbiome is highly individualized. That means some people’s microbiome appears to be more westernized, maybe more deteriorated, maybe more lower diversity.
Quite often that more deteriorated state of the gut microbiome is associated with chronic diseases, with obesity, with metabolic syndrome and things like that. On an individual level, there are companies that offer testing for the different species to give you the composition of what’s in your microbiome.
I can’t speak to the validity of any of these companies, but there are commercial entities out there that will provide a profile for individuals.
World Asthma Foundation: Thank you everything that you do on a daily basis for the gut microbiome, certainly for your teachings and your writings and for your time today. Appreciate it.
Dr. Justin L. Sonnenburg: Wonderful being with you. Thanks so much.
Defeating Asthma Series uncovers New Hope for Asthma Management
In this third interview with Martin J Blaser MD, Director of the Center for Advanced Biotechnology and Medicine at Rutgers Biomedical and Health Sciences and the Henry Rutgers Chair of the Human Microbiome and Professor of Medicine and Microbiology at the Rutgers Robert Wood Johnson Medical School in New Jersey and the Author of the “Missing Microbes – How the Overuse of Antibiotics is Fueling Our Modern Plagues.” we learn:
About the H. pylori and Asthma connection
Additional reserach looking into the connection between H. pylori and Asthma
Whether the Microbes can reintroduced
Video: Missing Microbes and Asthma Link Say Multiple Studies – Martin J Blaser MD
Asthma Foundation: Dr. Blaser, we’ve talked about the asthma connection and the H. pylori topic. Can you identify these missing microbes also with tests?
Dr. Blaser: Yes. The paper with Jakob Stokholm in Nature Communications looked at this– We saw that there was a difference in the microbiome in the kids that were one year old. That was the age at which their microbiome made a difference, whether they’d have a risk of asthma or not. Then we asked, “Okay, what’s the difference in the specific microbes at age one between the positives and the negatives?” We identified about 20 microbes that were significantly different, mostly lost, mostly missing.
What was interesting is that a group from British Columbia, led by Dr. Brett Finlay and colleagues had published about this also. They had found, I think, four or five organisms and we matched on four of the five. Again, two independent studies finding the same relationship makes it stronger
World Asthma Foundation: If I understand correctly, your research is determining whether or not you can repopulate the H. pylori. Is that independent of the intestinal microbes?
Dr. Blaser: In theory, yes. What’s interesting is that people have been interested in microbes and asthma for quite some time, and most of the concentration was in the large intestine, in the colon. We were interested in the stomach first, but then we got more involved in the colon also. I think that both compartments in the body are important. Both of them are important. They’re both subject to this terrible pressure of the disappearance of microbes because of such things as antibiotics and cesarean sections and the like. They’re both. All of these microbes are potentially replaceable. That’s the hope.
World Asthma Foundation: Fantastic, that’s the hope.
